When the blue backpack of Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon was found, there was a number of belongings found inside the backpack. Aside from the camera, two phones, two bras, there was also $83 in cash. All of these things deserve careful consideration, but the eighty three dollars was an especially notable item to me.
Before I dive in, this is just one of many of my collections of ideas regarding the case of Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon. A lot of foreigners aren’t able to have deep insights into life in Latin culture, so I want to offer some insights. You can’t learn this stuff in textbooks. My goal is to evaluate potential angles that others haven’t considered. Latin American life is different in subtle ways that can have a big impact on circumstances.
Also, I’ve started organizing all of my articles about them on this page: Kris Kremers Case Articles
Why is $83 interesting?
Obviously $83 sitting on a table tells us nothing. But it wasn’t sitting on a table. It was sitting in a non-waterproof backpack that supposedly washed up on the edge of a river, after two girls disappeared, near a region that has criminal activity. Cash money sitting in a poor public area after two girls disappeared says something.
One might think that $83 doesn’t deserve much attention. But this is Panama we’re talking about – a country with increasing crime and corruption. There are external considerations that deserve attention when cold hard cash is involved.
Below, I’m going to outline all of my thoughts regarding this. Again, the goal from this article isn’t to solve the case. I don’t have that ability, nor does anyone that was not directly involved. My goal is to share some insights from Latin America so that other people abroad might have a better chance at putting some pieces together.
An Intro Money in Panama
Let’s cover some basics. Just a warning – this initial part is boring, but necessary to set the stage.
Panama uses the United States Dollar as their currency. Traveling from the Netherlands, Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon would have had to transfer their Euros into United States dollars. Exchanging money can be a pain in the ass. Therefore, any foreigner that doesn’t use the US dollar in their home country would need to exchange money more than once during a trip. They would likely exchange more than is necessary in order to reduce their transaction fees and to prevent multiple trips to the ATM. For example, instead of spending $3 in ATM fees for $100, they might take $200 from the ATM in order to avoid paying $3 two times ($6).
That also assumes that ATM’s are available. It wasn’t easy to find ATMs in 2016 when I was visiting Bocas Del Toro, Panama, approximately a year after their disappearance. I remember that in some areas of Panama no ATM’s were available at all, which means that us backpackers always had to have backup cash in case we needed to hire a Taxi just to find an ATM.
Also, ATM’s can be dangerous. Opportunists know that foreigners visiting an ATM alone, especially after dark, is a chance to score some easy money. Therefore, travelers tend to avoid going to the ATM in general.
$83 is too much money for a hike.
A good initial question is: why would they go on a 3 hour nature hike with $83? Everything in Panama is very inexpensive. Perhaps they were uncomfortable to leave their money at the hotel they were staying. Or perhaps they planned to purchase something that we don’t know about. Or perhaps they simply didn’t think about it.
There’s a lot of possibilities for why they decided to bring that amount of money. But my point is that it’s simply an unnecessary amount of money. $10 or $20 would have been entirely sufficient for both (total) – it was only a brief hike. There is nothing that a person could purchase on a nature hike that justifies having $83. The only possible exceptions would be if they had planned to purchase groceries after the hike or if they planned to pay a tour guide during their hike.
It’s also worth mentioning that there’s evidence to suggest that Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon were frugal with their money. At one point locals suggested to investigators that the two girls were hitchhiking. Hitchhiking is a dangerous endeavor, especially in a foreign country that has increased crime. So, either the girls were taking an unnecessary risk, or they were being frugal, or locals were incorrect in claiming that they were hitchhiking. Any of these scenarios is equally possible.
Either it was intentional or it was unintentional to bring $83 with them. We don’t know. In either case, it’s unnecessary to bring $83 for a brief hike on Il Pianista Trail.
Cost of items in Panama.
$83 is a very rounded number. That probably sounds unusual. Allow me to explain. In developed countries, we often leave our coins at home and only travel with full “bills”. Who wants to carry around coins after all, right? Well, that’s not the case in undeveloped countries. A bottle of water costs about $0.35 in Panama, perhaps even less in 2014.
Vendors of water and snacks are usually local families that will carry their goods in a basket and sell them in streets and at tourist hot-spots. In most cases, vendors are not “stores” as you’d imagine in developed countries.
Having those nickels and dimes come in very handy, especially when local vendors can’t “break” a $10 or $20 bill, which happens to me often while backpacking. Having change on $20 for a $0.35 bottle of water is annoying to small vendors – so bringing change is convenient and respectful. More on the “respectful” aspect in a moment.
Sometimes items are priced in dollar increments. For example, supposedly Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon took a taxi that morning, before arriving at Il Pianista Trail. That taxi driver would have charged rounded fees, probably $3 or $5. I’ve never been charged an unrounded amount by a taxi driver in Central America. Similarly, hostels and hotels charge in rounded dollars. They were staying with a host family, but I’m unsure if that costs money. During my travels, I’ve only used hostels and hotels. The cost of a hostel room usually costs around $15. Bunk beds in hostels usually cost about $7.
However, nearly everything else is incremented in $0.10, $0.15 or $0.25. For example, nuts and fruit costs $0.25. Cookies cost $0.50. A lighter (for fire) costs $0.25. An egg costs $0.15. A pound of chicken costs $1.65.
So, I’m curious if the investigators rounded-off the dollar number when they published the $83 figure. Perhaps there was more change in the backpack but investigators thought it wasn’t worth mentioning. If they didn’t round the number and there was in fact exactly $83, then that feels unusual to me.
Inconveniences and coins.
Locals throughout Latin America work hard for their money. They’re willing to do tasks that most people from developing countries would scoff at. For example, it’s very common to see locals selling little individually packages of roasted peanuts for $0.25 each. They’ll walk around their town, sometimes with their children, in the humid conditions in order to earn $2 to $3 for the day.
If a foreigner doesn’t have change, it immediately presents an inconvenience to locals. The larger the denomination used to pay, the more the inconvenience. For example, using a $20 bill is less convenient than using a $5 bill for a $0.50 item. Most foreigners wouldn’t know to carry a large diversity in bills and change because foreigners are accustomed to buying food from “official” brick and mortar stores. So, if Kris Kremers or Lisanne Froon had wanted to purchase something without having coins, it would have presented a slight inconvenience.
The girls had already travelled through Panama long enough to learn this. It only takes two to three days in Latin America to learn that having coins is necessary. Their trip started two weeks before their disappearance. Even in the tourist areas Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon would have had ample chances to learn the necessity of carrying coins.
Even if Kris and Lisanne didn’t start their day with coins, they certainly would have received coins from change if they had purchased something. So, let’s look at that.
Did they purchase something?
Travelers from foreign countries often carry rounded amounts of money. In this case, $83 suggests that they may have initially travelled with $100. Obviously the difference is $17. So, based on a lot of assumptions, we can speculate a little bit about what they could have purchased. Here are the most likely possibilities:
- Water
- Snacks or food
- Their room/home for the day – Hostels and hotels often collect cash in the morning between 11:00 AM and 1:00PM. However, I’m not sure of the cost arrangements for staying with a host family.
- Taxi Services – their taxi driver, whom was later found dead, claimed that they took a taxi to arrive at Il Pianista trail.
- Bracelets – Lisanne clearly is wearing bracelets in one photo but not in the other photo. It’s common for travelers to buy bracelets and other hand-made crafts from local vendors, especially in “touristy” places such as Boquete.
The only things on this list that are incremented in full dollars is the taxi fare and the room. Food and water would cost less than $1 for each item. Bracelets vary and are less determinable, sometimes costing $1 and sometimes costing $1.50, etc.
Update 8/17/20: One of my readers pointed out to me that one of the bands on her left wrist was used as a hair tie. Also, I’ve investigated prior photos and realized that Lisanne Froon was, in fact, wearing two bracelets on her right wrist prior to this hike. Therefore we can safely ignore the possibility that bracelets were purchased during their hike.
Using $83 for help
Money comes in handy when a traveler needs help, especially in moments of desperation. Locals and indigenous people often give their advice for free. However, tipping someone $0.50 or $1.00 is a good way to show your appreciation.
Needless to say, $83 is a significant amount of money in respect to “getting help”. If the girls were injured or captured and perhaps needed to “bribe” their way to safer conditions, they would have had more than enough money to do so. So, the only other reason that the $83 wouldn’t have worked as a “bribe” is in two conditions: They truly died naturally (you can’t bribe nature), or the fear of danger was greater than a bribe.
Locals will never compromise their own safety for money and the reason is clear: There’s no amount of money that can guarantee their family’s safety. The moment after accepting a bribe and hindering a criminal’s efforts would be the precise moment that a target would be placed on the door of their family’s house. This fear is an effective form of terrorism. Let’s remember, the parents offered a $30,000 reward and nobody came forward. That shows the incredible silencing power behind threats. There are only two motivators: fear and desire. Both are very powerful.
The Locals
There’s a lot of wonderful people throughout Central America. In fact, 95% of locals are friendly, charming, honest and good natured. It’s one of the many reasons that I absolutely love living in Latin America. Many locals will go great lengths to help a foreigner. Even just knowing “buenos dias” (good morning), “por favor” (please) and “gracias” (thanks) goes a long way in winning appreciation.
In Panama, there’s a diverse mix of people. There’s expat foreigners, indigenous tribes and non-indigenous Panamanians. For now, I’m going to oversimplify and let those be the three groups that we discuss. Of course, there is further diversity in each of those three groups, but I’m going to simplify this for the purpose of convenience.
In Alto Romero, where the backpack was found, is the Ngöbe-Buglé indigenous tribe of Panama. As much as I know about them, they are a peaceful people and just want to care for their families and community. The only exception is when the threat of violence is directed at them. In that case, they’ll go silent. This is a matter of survival. If they heard cries for help, they would only offer assistance if there was no immediate threat nearby.
It’s difficult to evaluate the other locals. Unfortunately, criminal activity muddies the analysis. While most locals are good and wonderful people, it’s sometimes difficult to identify the “good” people due to fear in communities. Crime in the area is a growing issue, and particularly attracts youth. Solicited or not, usually it’s a matter of pressure. Youth are socially active in the community, youth socialize more, and youth are the most vulnerable to being pressured into criminal involvement. It’s a scary and unfortunate situation for kids and families.
The concept of “support” in latin culture often comes with the “either you’re with us or you’re against us” mentality. “Do you support me?” often means “will you protect me if people ask questions?”. This is one reason why gang activity proliferates in Latin America. Respect is often completely void of “trust” and is usually only representative of submission. For example: “I won’t say anything because I know what will happen if I do”. In fact, trust exists to a substantially lesser extent than in lesser developed countries, and the reason is clear: Corruption runs rampant, Police are sometimes involved, and locals already have enough challenges in their own life. They simply don’t want more “problems”.
Parents will protect their children’s secrets, even if they disagree with their behavior. Not only do they love their children, but giving up a child (to law enforcement) is equivalent to giving up a vital resource, someone that can provide for the family and someone that they can trust more than other people in their community. A lesser-defined form of tribalism is prevalent even in people that are not indigenous, nor part of a tribe. In many ways, this other form of tribalism can be attributed to gang and group protection.
Backpacks Don’t Float
Supposedly the backpack had travelled downstream from the area where the two girls had died. The backpack was nothing fancy. It was not waterproof. It’s straps were rather flimsy and not reinforced which speaks to the rather low quality of the backpack, implying that it lacks a higher level of durability.
Let’s remember that even waterproof backpacks are typically not designed to be submerged in lakes and rivers. Most waterproof backpacks are simply designed to protect items from rain and splashing. That’s why travelers that want guaranteed water protection will purchase a dry sack or dry bag. Those other types of bags are designed for kayaking and extreme sports.
In any event, Kris Kremers blue backpack was not a quality backpack, therefore it would have gotten soaked and water-logged within 2 minutes of being placed in a river. If the river velocity was forceful enough to push it downstream, it would have been forceful enough to drench the inside contents of the backpack.
Brown and grey mold would have been on the backpack. As anyone in Central America will tell you, leaving any type of fabric in the rain will eventually be covered in a brown moldy residue which is difficult to clean by hand. The moisture in the air tends to create optimal conditions for mold to flourish. So, if this backpack was in or near the river, and exposed to rainstorms, there’s no explanation for why the backpack would be void of mold – other than human involvement.
The conditions of both the river and the rainy season would drench any items left exposed to the elements, waterproof or not. The rainy season of Central America often coats everything in a thin film of moisture. The air is so incredibly moist that it is inescapable, even often indoors when the rain is heaviest. Keeping clothes dry, even inside the home, is sometimes a challenge for locals and often entails covering clothes with sheets of plastic. The air gets incredibly moist!
The Backpack Randomly Appears
Considering that backpacks don’t float, the next question is how the backpack got there. It’s very simple – someone placed it there. It’s not too far-fetched to imagine.
Imagine that you’re a criminal with incriminating evidence in your possession. You want two things to happen:
- You want to rid yourself of the evidence.
- You want local search crews to stop searching (because it’s probably making you uncomfortable).
Notice number 2 above. It’s interesting because it suggests that perhaps someone utilized the backpack and remains as a deterrent to stop the local search crews from searching and reduce pressure that they were feeling. This absolutely suggests that it was someone local. Otherwise, why not simply toss the backpack into a ditch or a hole somewhere? Surely criminals wouldn’t have any other purpose – certainly they were not kind enough to give “closure” to the family. The criminals wanted investigators to stop searching for answers.
So, by placing the bones and backpack just barely outside of the view of search teams, they cleverly accomplished both of their goals. The bones and backpack were placed in public, someone found the bones, nearby searches stopped, the investigation slowed and the killer(s) got away.
In my other article about Kris Kremers bleached bones, I concluded that the killers were likely novices. And I still believe that. However, the clever trick of placing the backpack downstream essentially implies that someone more mature and methodical assisted them to help them cover their tracks.
So, I definitely believe that more than one person was involved, at least to some degree.
An Exposed Backpack In A Poor Village
I do not believe that the indigenous people were involved in the crime. If they had been, the backpack would not have been found on their land. Plus, they don’t “need” a lot of money as I’ll demonstrate in a moment. I believe that the backpack was placed there from another local, not affiliated with the tribe, and was attempting to mislead investigators into believing that somehow the tribe was involved.
The blue backpack and its contents were essentially a “hot potato” that needed to be discarded. And it was discarded in a clever way. Perhaps the backpack was even placed near this indigenous tribe as a “message” or threat to the tribe itself claiming that if they didn’t comply with private demands then things would get worse for them.
The tribes of Panama are already under significant pressure from criminal groups and the Panamanian government itself, both of which are encroaching on their beautiful land for mineral rights, water extraction and construction development for commercialism. It’s an ongoing issue that results in urban spread and deforestation.
The local value of $83.
Cash money carries value in all parts of the world. By Panama’s standards, in the Boquete region of Panama, $83 is equivalent to approximately one weeks pay for a standard local. To indigenous tribe members $83 is significantly more money considering that they often earn less than $300 for the entire year.
Indigenous tribes are highly self-sufficient from farming. They live as farmers, make their own clothes, build their own houses, raise their own cattle and educate their own children. To a tribe member, finding $83 would feel wrong. It would feel dangerous. It’s equivalent to finding a suitcase of cocaine in a developed country. Surely nobody in a tribe would want to touch $83 except for an honest person that would bring it to the authorities. Again, I’m offering my perspective. I could be wrong.
The more likely culprit responsible for placing the backpack in Alto Romero was a local from Boquete that had some form of frustration against these female foreigners and knew that foreigners wouldn’t be informed enough about the local social culture to draw conclusions. Additionally, as I’ve mentioned before, the person was likely young and probably had some form of relationship to criminal activity in the area, whether direct or indirect. Even if they weren’t in a gang, they probably had some form of association with them – it’s somewhat inescapable for youth in most regions of Latin America.
The $83 to muddy the circumstances.
Given the many inconsistencies of this case and the unexplainable aspects, I’m certain that human involvement resulted in their disappearance. Therefore I’m also certain that the backpack was placed there. And by default I’m also certain that the $83 was intentionally left in the backpack. This is undoubtedly not a perfect logic tree, but it’s approximate enough for me.
Many might assume that the $83 leads a person to conclude that it was an accident. However, I think the opposite. I believe that the $83 being present implies that someone attempted to murky the motives of the crime. Since the cash was in the backpack, it implies that the motive wasn’t robbery. But it absolutely does not imply that other more sinister motives were not at play.
Aside from money, foreign women have two other forms of value that could result in potential motives – their body and their sense of empowerment. Any young man with spiking testosterone levels will feel a sense of frustration for being rejected by a woman. Adding insult to injury could have been the manner in which the man was rejected.
Facing rejection from a foreign woman in one’s own country and being rejected in a way that led to embarrassment, perhaps in front of other male friends, in an environment with no other foreigners present, could quickly escalate to a dangerous scenario. Unfortunately, exerting dominance is sometimes the recourse.
Men often compete amongst each other by utilizing various forms of challenges. A challenge from a female foreigner may not be welcomed, especially in the form of a rejection coinciding with perceived mockery, such as a direct laugh or a challenge to one’s intellect. If one man responded by heavily exerting dominance, possibly accidentally inflicting injury on one of the two women, the situation could easily and quickly deteriorate. Even a slight push that resulted in a slip and fall accident could have created a bad situation.
We can’t know what happened. We only know that two educated foreign women disappeared.
This story is one reason why I suggest to foreign men and women that visit Latin America to avoid situations being alone when in public. In this case, Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon both disappeared during broad daylight on a sunny day. Your independence is wonderful until it no longer exists.
Secondly, I suggest that women treat demonstrations of interest from local men with caution, especially when alone. If the scenario does occur, foreign women should express a sense of graciousness and flattery but also change course to escape the situation in a methodical and respectful manner. Do not laugh at any point during the situation. Laughing can make one feel embarrassed and disrespected, thus heightening frustration.
Granted, most locals are kind, respectful and reasonable. Some of my great friends are latino men – and they also advise caution as well. A local persons demeanor is largely influenced by various factors such as education, past experience socializing with foreigners, socioeconomic class, family upbringing, religious considerations and more.
Bank Account History Considerations
As a final note, the bank account history could be insightful. One could make a lot of determinations about the girl’s spending behaviors based on historical bank records. Surely, the families and investigators have access to that information. It would show their withdrawal history, other expenses and the locations where they used their bank cards.
What would be particularly interesting, and perhaps helpful to their investigating their case, may be to analyze trends their spending behavior. Although this is information is undoubtedly private, and should remain private, spending behavior can perhaps lead to more insight into why they carried $83 with them.
For example, did they typically withdraw $100 or more? Did they combine their money or use their own money separately? Were they known for purchasing small items, like bracelets? If not, could the bracelets be a gift, and from whom? What were their most recent card transactions? These are hypothetical questions. It’s the responsibility of law enforcement to investigate these questions.
Also, I wonder if they had booked anything or had plans that could have involved needing $83.
Monetary considerations are only one part of the equation. I believe that the fact that they were two women from a developed nation with vast cultural differences is more relevant to Kris Kremers and Lisanne Froon’s disappearance.
Please note: Our team is committed to accuracy of information and respecting the privacy of those involved with this disappearance case. If you have any supplementary information regarding the case, or if you were involved in this case and feel that the information available in this article impacts your privacy, please contact our team.
You all make $83 seem like it’s the whole world. When i went to Colombia i brought $5 grand with me and i carried my passport and money always on me. Even when i went to the gym at the hotel. Im glad i did it too, because after i came back to my room from the gym i noticed somebody had been in it. I think they went to my room thinking i left all my valuables behind since i was working out. Allegedly it was house-keeping but they never picked up my dirty towels from the bathroom floor. Told the hotel manager to check the security cameras but they were “broken” in that wing of the hotel. I stayed at the Inter-continetal in Medellin. I knew not to go to the barrio or rough places or the jungle to ask for trouble. The only way you go there is if you know the criminal leader for that area and you have his blessing and protection to be there. I did hire my fiends cousins finances brother who was a cab driver. He picked up me every morning and dropped me off at night or he waited for me if i had to go back to my room. i paid him $100 CDN a day and i got all our meals. I felt super safe with him. Him i went to the ghetto with just to tour it.
I‘m dealing with this topic for a few months now, and I‘ve read tons of articles. It just catches me somehow. A few days ago, when I was reading about this case again, suddenly it came to my mind that both of the girls probably had social media accounts that never got deleted. So I searched for them on Instagram and I found Kris account, the last picture was uploaded there on September 2013. I checked the comments and got stuck by the comment of a girl, who remembers seeing Kris and Lisanne on the Pianista Trail on their way to a viewpoint around 10:30. The girl who commented, travelled with her father, who suddenly got stomach issues, so they decided to take a break and stopped, around 70 meters away from the bridge.
Then she saw three people approaching, two females and one male.
She says that she saw Kris and Lisanne, accompanied by a young light brownskinned man, who she later recognized as the taxi driver. She could see them, but they couldn’t see her.
She said she already tried to contact the families of both of them, but she wasn‘t able to find anything about them.
As I know, the taxi driver told the police, he dropped off the girls at the trail and left, which seems now, regarding the observation of the commenting girl, as a big fat lie. It seems like he accompanied them. On the trail.
Regarding foul play: were Kremers and Froon platonic friends, or lovers? I ask because recently (August ’21), a married lesbian couple camping on the outskirts of Moab, Utah (where I lived for 11 years) were found murdered by gunshot. They had told friends that a “creeper dude” was bothering them at their campsite, and they were going to move it. The suspect has not been found to date. Appears to be a hate crime. A similar case occurred a few years ago on the Appalachian trail: some Jethro mountain man espied two lesbians making love just off the trail — it enraged him and he murdered both. He confessed to the crime and motivation.
Whatever their relationship, Kremers and Froon might have been perceived as lesbians. There are hate-crime murders of LGBQT people even in urban areas today; in rural and tribal areas, this is even more offensive to traditional values, and might have been a motive for attacking them.
In Houston about a decade ago, a Latino gang was initiating two young new members in a park when they saw two teen girls walking home from a party — at night. The gang members raped and strangled both girls. It wasn’t planned — they weren’t hunting for vicitms — but purely opportunistic.
From the Inuit in Alaska to tribes in the Amazon to Papua New Guinea, territorial boundaries are considered inviolate in many traditional societies A stranger wandering into one tribe’s or clan’s territory is considered suspicious and fair game — they are routinely killed, no questions asked. Or at least it used to be that way in many regions.
In Mexico, few people in the villages were shorts, and any woman clad as skimpily (and provocatively) as Kremers and Froon would be subject to relentless sexual harassment. For some local teens or gang members with low impulse control, two beautiful, half-dressed Nordic women prowling in their territory might have been a temptation too strong to resist.
Kremer’s shorts were found, without a trace of her body within. The two bras were found… the implications are obvious.
I believe the money was left in there to throw people off. If they had no money in the bag people would suspect a robbery gone wrong and keep digging into the case. Having the belongings intact makes it easier to blame a slip and fall that killed them. (As illogical as that is.)
Were i with a friend, i may think 3 hour hike out, 3 hour hike back, go out to casual dinner at the end, using money saved on not having a tour guide for an easy out-and-back trail. Reach summit in only 2 hours unexpectedly, spend another hour exploring forward before turning back. Is there a published list of property found in the room? Any birth control?
Its a good analysis, but although you make a strong case for why the back pack appeared, it is clear that whoever was making the fake attempted emergency calls from the girls’ mobiles began doing it within a day (2nd) and continued with a regular schedule of calls made at times suggesting a break from work. And making the fake calls was only an acceptable risk because they thought the phones could not connect. It seems to me that whoever was making those fake attempted calls was not doing so from Boquete but over the continental divide from a farm, which makes me think the girls were abducted by someone with a property not all that far from the trail. He would have to be a very cool customer to abduct women so close to his farm. But I think there is other evidence for this being an iceman. The cell phones containing the calls had to be given to the authorities. So on the 2nd after 13 hour he began a multi stage ploy (quite possible thought out beforehand) and that plan proceeded with the fake attempted calls from the 2nd to the 11th. However, this was not going to be worthwhile unless the phones could be examined by the authorities. Therefore, the plan entailed that that at some point in the future the phones would have to be left where they could be discovered, thereby allowing the the fake attempted calls for help to mislead an investigation. After finishing making the calls the guy waited 8 weeks, and during that time he had to store the items. almost certainly inside, which would be extremely incriminating. Yet he did that for months. This sort of prior planning and patiently carrying out a scheme over an extended time requires a very unusual and methodical person, and I don’t think it sounds like a young man at all. Would an older relative be in on something like these after only 13 hours? I think the culprit(s) in this case are much older that one would think. Furthermore, I cannot see repeated trips to the village of Alto Romero and the surrounding area being made to plant the backpack and the remains by anyone from outside there because it is so isolated interlopers would be noticed and later recalled. You have made a good case for it not being an indigenous tribal person. There is someone involved in this thing who seems to fit the profile and keeps popping up just a little too often. While I don’t think the case is even balance of probability the guide must be considered a viable suspect.
I have pondered this unsolved mystery numerous times over the years and even to this day when I read threads like these … many things leave me unsettled .
Lots of great amateur investigators and researchers out there . I applaud you for doing due diligence in being thorough . I do hope that eventually more evidence or testimony will be uncovered and answers will be provided for these two young girls families who to this day live with the mystery and tragedy of this .
My sense is there is no one absolute scenario . I think there is some combination of the many theories regarding their disappearance and death.
Apologies for following bullet points and stream of consciousness but here are my thoughts :
1. Local and country officials totally botched the entire search and investigation. ( either due to ineptitude, lack of funds, resources and good forensic technology or plain greed and corruption )
2. The girls due to youth mentality of invincibility decided to continue their hike beyond the continental divide ( to see some specific site or waterfalls they had heard about from locals or fellow travellers)
3. Once they continued on , they realised the hike was longer or more moderate in terrain and attempted to double back to Boquete .
4. At that time they encountered locals or some other unknown party that either cajoled or forced them to abandon returning .
5.The girls Possibly tried to avoid these individuals or run away from them and went down a side path or trail.
6. At this point they dialled the first sos attempt . In a panic or attempting to find a way back around to the trail they became lost . Unknown parties continued to pursue them .
7.At some point one or more became minorly injured but were still able to attempt calling for assistance.
8. After being completely lost, malnourished, dehydrated and in a panic Kris Fell and was seriously injured . Lisanne continued on to find help. Lisanne returns to Kris and attempts various SOS attempts . Once Kris succumbs LIsanne moves on in a last ditch attempt to find help and later succumbs to the elements . Rain fall and flash floods eventually do the rest of what we know regarding evidence .
OR At some point, an unknown party caught up to them . Kris being more injured was overtaken and Lissanne escaped . Later she was captured eventually after attempting to elude certain parties .
Nagging anomalies-
The back pack –
It never made it to the river . It was placed there by perpetrators or locals who found it on a rock outcropping from which Lisanne fell from .
If a random uninvolved local or tribe member found it then they were afraid to first reveal its location out of fear of being blamed for the girls death . So they placed it in an area that another would find it .
Otherwise, it was “ found” so that the case would be closed.
Either way , there is no way the phones and items in bag were in that good of co diction if they were in the river.
Things that are unsettling :
The extreme involvement of the tour guide in the entire search and in being one of those finding the evidence
The similar types of disappearances in that same region over the same time frame and the partial success by the Panamanian government to cover them up or scrub them from the internet .
The bones of other found among the girls remains. Yes , it could point to flow pattern of the river when it is flooded but it can equally point to a common and useful “ dumping “ ground for cartel etc .
I am very curious about some of the items found in the backpack. If they were simply planning to take a short hike and back – why were there two bras found in the backpack? Why would they even think to pack two extra bras if they’d only packed a small backpack with essentials for a very short hike? If those had been the bras they’d been wearing, why would they remove them and put them in their backpack? I can’t imagine any scenario where this makes sense for the girls to have done either of these things. I have never seen anyone address this specifically. The young ladies were wearing tank tops in the photos, so I’d be curious to try to compare the bra straps to any photos that may reveal them. It just doesn’t make any sense to me why these would be in the backpack. I have also read about the clothing found – possibly folded or found in the river… but I can’t seem to find photographs of these items or detailed descriptions of the conditions of the clothing. Depending on the condition of the clothing, that could rule out several possible outcomes.
Some thoughts:
I believe that things went wrong at already april 1. They returned from the hike and then went to Caldera Hot Springs where had a bath with two guys. After the hike!
The two photos at the creek with Kris were taken by a third party, not Lisanne. Why Lisanne would take shots like these of Kris? Kris’s legs and denim short is dirty of mud. I think she was run and fell.
The Mirador pictures and the night pictures were edited by a third party before the backpack was found.
The picture of a branch with pink bags on it was taken on the bank of a stream or river, on a large round stone, with a bridge in the background. The pattern seen behind the stone is not vegetation but flowing water in the dark.
Kris’s head seems not injured in the picture about her hair. It seems like it has taken indoor, not in the forest, and her hair was dry and clean. It doesn’t look like hair soaked in the rain and then dried. Although two hours before the picture was taken, the night photos show that it was raining.
It’s not really important, but there was no dog with them. It not appears in any picture what is simply impossible.
It was a foul play, that is clear. They has died not on the hike, probably not in that forest.
I’m illegal quantity of course, sorry 🙂
Seems in the top left hair pic. Is a white pattern object. Almost like a blanket on a bed.
I have been hiking for over 20 years, although not in Panama. My thoughts were that at some point along the way Kris Kremers received a head injury, unknown source. It is at the point in the video that the commentator mentions that indigenous people live in the area. Then my mind shifted in these girls were taken, held, assaulted and eventually eaten by these indigenous people. Who manipulated the camera, folded the clothing and laid them out to be found. I prey to GOD that this is not what happened! Any Force8 folks see this, contact 8Ball.
Are you aware that other human remains were found with the two girls remains. There was more bodies there. That says a lot, it tells me they were definitely murder
I disagree. Accidents at the cablebridges seem to be much more common than there are official records about it. Especially among the indigenous.
To find more than one persons bone fragments at the same place may very likely be a result of the hydrodynamics of the river.
Just like gold acumulates at specific areas in a riverbed for example.
To me this fact supports more the slip and fall theory.
Your viewpoints actually make a lot of sense; read a few others. I also think there was human involvement due to the obvious distractions of the dry, neat backpack in a random place. The remains found are further indicators. Also the condition of the remains – ankle in boot, part of pelvic bone.
Leaving the $83 and the phones and camera is also a distraction to imply they were lost. Why 1 passport and travel insurance?
There is also the deleted photos which could imply the girls snapped the person(s).
I do not believe the girls went wandering off on their own. Any theory implying lost or injured is utter non sense. Central American jungles are known to be dangerous.
I thought of the possibility that maybe it was a hostile tribe member could have been involved as there were later reports of human sacrifices. Prior to the latter I thought of human sacrifice as a possibility. A tribe member could have left them with their cell phones not knowing the value of the technology hence they were able to make many calls to emergency services. Additionally, the many random photos taken at night can be indicative of someone who is unfamiliar with a camera and just pressing it cluelessly. Maybe the attempts to enter pin wrongly could have been by the ‘tribe’ person just ‘playing’ around with the device just as with the camera. Could have also just been someone who was unfamiliar with technology.
The photo on the river bed shows her face looking more concerned as analysts suggested. Maybe the other girl was taking the photos while the ‘person’ was behind her talking and maybe describing the off route tour he suggested.
You mentioned the taxi driver was later killed. What were the details? That adds questions. When I first read of the story I wondered if the taxi driver was properly questioned.
A theory:
I think that Kris and Lisanne might’ve been taken on the late afternoon of April 1st. I believe they were kept somewhere captive and subjected to abuse.
If the dog was with them, the fact that they were now with persons he may have been familiar with and because night was falling, these factors could have caused the dog to feel his job was over and he left them to go home.
They may have escaped their assailants on the early morning/night hours of April 8th.
They were able to leave with their backpack which, at this time contained their belongings that were later found, but also had many papers in it and snacks. This accounts for all of the strewn papers on the large rock in the nighttime pictures, including what looks like a folded up map. (matching the one L had in earlier pictures – end of March?) I know when I travel I often accumulate mounds of papers- especially if you are the type that may want to save mementos to put in a photo album later. For me that means maps, brochures, flyers, receipts etc. all get kept and usually in the bag I most often carry around.
In addition to this, a reflective item on the rock (in another of the night pictures) looks as though it might be the bottom of a snack or food container with the cardboard sides of the cylinder ripped off leaving only the bottom which the girls may have noticed was reflective and might attract help to them when light came the next morning. (A snack such as a canister of Ligo cheese crunch)
The orange bags that were hung on the branch match the orange bags that were in their apartment and which K is seen carrying in earlier pictures. Perhaps they had orange plastic bags containing snacks that they had purchased that morning or in the days proceeding and before they left they threw them in the backpack.
If I had been abducted and then escaped and it was in the middle of nowhere my first instincts would involve getting as far away from the abductors as possible, but also being found by my family and friends. I think the girls, after escaping, had similar thoughts (they no doubt had little idea where they were at that point) and concluded that reflective surfaces and bright orange might help them to be found. But you cannot be found in a jungle from the air unless you are in a clearing or at least in an area with a little bit less foliage which would allow rescuers to see down into the forest. I think that may be why they were taking pics of the sky above them. To try to assess whether or not they were in a clearing or at least an area where their beacons might have a chance of being seen. This might also account for a picture being taken of what looks like the chin and side of L face. Taking a picture of the sky above them and catching just the edge of her face would have lit up her head in the picture and everything else would’ve been pitch black in that particular picture.
I think they may have taken the pictures of the branch draped with the orange bags and the picture of the rock with the reflective surface (possibly bottom of cylinder snack container) in order to see their work.
They may have used the cameras flash often to light the area around them, thus snapping many pictures. If I were in a jungle at night with a camera and one working cell phone I would save the cell phone battery (L phone battery had died at this point) and use the cameras flash every time I thought I heard a noise. How terrifying – so who wouldn’t use any accessible light source they had to attempt to see what might be around them in the darkness.
Another thought, it’s possible, even probable, that the girls phones were eventually taken away at some point by their assailants and that would account for their not turning K phone back on and attempting another emergency call on the night of the 8th while they were wandering the jungle. They couldn’t try another emergency call if they didn’t have the phone at that point.
The picture of K hair could have been something as simple as an accidental picture being taken by L (that K inadvertently got in the path of) or K may have felt as though a critter landed on her or was in her hair and the camera flash revealed nothing but was a way to “see.” This may be a stretch but if you think of all of the events that happens to any of us in a single 24 hours they are all random. Or, perhaps a creature in her hair may seem very small in comparison to what they just went through but I would still be concerned about poisonous or dangerous animals in that situation even if I had just gone through and escaped a horrific situation. Who wants to escape all of that just to die of a spider bite at night in the middle of the jungle.
It’s then possible that their abductors found them again, removed and gathered all of their homemade beacons and belongings and brought them back to wherever they kept them captive. K was killed first, L was killed much later.
The abductors did not anticipate the intensity of the search that would occur after the girls were declared missing and, anxious for the searching to stop, tried to frame the situation to look as though the girls disappeared in some sort of natural way. They thought that putting their remains near the River AND allowing their backpack with $83 in it to be found would surely prove that there was no foul play.
Perhaps this may have fooled everyone but the backpack was in too good condition and something unnatural had clearly occurred to K remains/body. In addition to this, how had the clothes and backpack not been seen up until that point?!
The unnatural processing of K probably happened before they knew that they would later feel compelled to leave evidence in hopes that the case could be closed already.
The phone call attempts made from L and K cell phones on the 1st and subsequent 2 days makes sense but if K was still alive as late as the 8th of April, why would her cell phone have been unsuccessfully accessed? Like I surmised earlier, their phones may have been taken away on the 4th or 5th – L phone was on when taken possession of thus the battery running out and K phone was off but turned on on the 6th by someone (not the girls) and wrong PIN numbers were tried many times but never entered correctly.
When the girls escaped for a brief time the night of April 8th, they did NOT have the phones with them. The cell phones were only accessed one more time on the 11th then only returned to the backpack when suspicion of foul play needed to be squelched. The abductors returned the phones, along with the girls other belongings and placed the backpack and shorts in different places by the river and later threw remains around to be found. They would’ve known that the shoe containing the foot was definitely L but because they disposed of K body much earlier – and probably along with other victims bodies – they could not be sure of which bones were hers and so they simply gathered many bones from the disposal site to plant in the jungle to be found along with L foot.
I came to these possible conclusions based on my own intuition and different factors that I feel are just facts even if I don’t personally have any proof or special knowledge.
So many details of this case point to the girls being taken and remaining alive for a number of days.
The girls getting lost on a trail that was apparently very clearly marked and traveled by many people daily makes me ask – HOW would they have gotten lost? By the same token, if they were injured surely somebody would have come upon them. This makes me feel that they had to have been taken by somebody.
It’s no stretch to believe that there is an evil group of people in that area who prey on vulnerable persons. From what I understand there have been many missing persons, murders and suspicious deaths in that area. Evil persons don’t always need to have clear motives but in this case they probably took the girls for sick sexual reasons.
When I saw the nighttime pictures, and being a older woman that very much loves nature but is scared of the dark, I immediately felt certain that a great deal of the pictures were taken, not for the pictures themselves, but to use the light from the flash. I just feel so certain about that. The pictures of the branch on the rock with the orange plastic and the reflective item on the rock with all of the paper around it are, in my mind, their best attempts at emergency beacons.
And when it comes to who may have taken these pictures, there is no other conclusion but that it was the girls. Who else would’ve taken these pictures? And for what purpose? Also, Kris was clearly there. They may both have been in tough condition, certainly mentally but also physically, from days of abuse but the picture of Lisannes Chin and side of her face and the picture of Kris hair prove they were both there and I don’t think it’s strange at all that the pictures were what they were… I have totally used camera flash as lighting before while camping and I regularly use my iPad glow as lighting when I use the bathroom at night at home.
Also, when everyone wonders why the pictures are so strange and why they didn’t leave messages or better quality pictures, I don’t think it’s very strange. Maybe they didn’t want to mentally go to that place in your brain that says you are going to die. That would account for their not leaving goodbye messages or explanations on their phones. And they were maybe hoping they were on their way to freedom so thinking about what pictures were on their camera and how they looked would not have been nearly as important as using that light. And it certainly wasn’t a time for a selfie or posed pictures with an actual camera in the middle of the night.
All of that being said, I personally would’ve left a message for my loved ones but I tend to be a cynic – glass is half empty – realist type of person. I am also a lot older than these girls though and when I was their age I was a lot more naïve and thought I was invincible.
I think it’s also a given that the backpack, shorts and remains were planted by someone. I don’t think there’s any getting around that – if the backpack and contents were in as good a condition as they sound like they were. The money being left in the bag is 100% on purpose in order to make people feel that there couldn’t have been other persons involved because ‘money would never have been left if a human attack was involved.’
This theory is just that, a theory. I have no real idea and I have not been researching this case very long, literally a handful of days since I discovered this information online. But, this is just what jumped out to me. Any thoughts?
Hi Chris,
some thought:
-Kris and Lisanne didn’t stay in a hotel or hostel, but at a host family. A Panamanian family with whom they had their own room.
-The bracelets are most likely elastic bands which Lisanne had either in her hair around her ponytail or around her wrist whenever she wore her hair loose
-The coins could have been in the pockets of their pants. Lisanne’s shorts were never found, she may have carried the coins in her pockets and the dollar bills in the backpack?
-In the Caldera area there may have been stuff to do, such as a zipline (where some of the ‘suspects’ in this case worked at the time); perhaps they brought the money for such an activity. There is a never confirmed swimming photo of them, after all, seemingly also taken in the Caldera area
Hi Scarlet,
Great points. I’ve updated the article to reflect that they did not purchase bracelets. Also, it’s true that they could have kept coins in their pants pockets – it’s certainly possible.
Regarding your last comment, about the $83 being for ziplining (or potentially for other activities) – I lean towards that as well. The numerous inconsistencies in evidence suggest that they were involved in more activities than just a simple day hiking. Like you, I believe that the Osman swimming photo was a telling piece, especially the fact that Osman died only 3 days after the girls disappeared.
Thank you and cheers. Great work on your blog.
I just started reading about this case. The dry backpack stands out. Also that these girls were supposed to meet a tour guide to this same area the next day. I keep thinking that the tour guide changed their meet-up to a day earlier as an alibi perhaps planning to murder them, and the money can be explained by the fact they’d be paying the guide. Why would they hire a guide and then take off a day before their appointment without him?
i don’t have experience of travel in South America but do in Asia/India, there are very few of those countries where i be happy about leaving money/passport in a room of hostel/cheap hotel.
Re a photo with bracelets as alleged proof of Photoshop: it’s not a bracelet on Lisanne’s left wrist. It’s a hairband. In first photo, she has it in her hair. In 2nd, her hair is down and band is on her left wrist.
I do this all the time, too…
Hi Alice, I’m not sure where you read of “alleged proof of photoshop”. I certainly did not insinuate that in this article – perhaps you read that somewhere else?
Regarding a different matter: on further inspection of the photos, I’ve overlooked the fact that she had two bracelets on her right wrist in photos prior to their hike. You are correct – the band on her left wrist appears to be the hair tie that she uses to put up her hair. I’ve noted an update in the article.
Thank you for pointing this out! Good eyes! Cheers
Comment from private spheres to the public: Attention, this theory is based on research and the facts are correct. However, there is a little uncertainty or a detail which element is.
The famous picture with Kris and Lisanne with 2 “gentlemen” in the water was taken with an iPhone 4, this is undoubtedly the case.
The iPhone was black. Kris’ iPhone was also an iPhone 4, also black.
At the time Osman’s body was found, Kris’ iPhone was used for the first time without a PIN. We are really talking about a 30 minute difference.
The iPhone was important, attempts were made to unlock the phone. Not necessary for an emergency call, it had to have been about the content.
Is it possible that the iPhones were mixed up? This could be fatal because Osman’s phone was never released. It was officially an accident, so there was no need to confess.
ATTENTION: It is 99% certain that it is Kris and Lisanne, but the time is unknown or not 100% certain. The way and how the picture was published is not understandable.
That´s an interesting thought (exchange of cell phones).
Question is, into which scenario does this fit?
How do you know that Osman´s cellphone was same model and same color as Kris´ phone?
Something else occurred to me last night when I was in the throes of insomnia. When the calls for emergency help were made, who actually dialed the numbers? Both phones were used as I understand; is this correct? If so, I would assume that each woman used her own phone (and had the ability to do so. If this was the case, then whatever accident or injury that might have happened probably was not life-threatening or at least did not compromise their use of the phones.
Let’s say that there was an injury to Kris–would Lisanne know the code to Kris’s phone? If so, she would be able to make the call at that point and in the future.
If Lisanne was hurt and Kris was the one in better shape than why were there so many futile attempts to unlock her phone several days later?
Another thought crossed my mind as well. If I were lost in the middle of a deep, dark rain forest as night approached, I would hunker down and wait until daybreak to summon help. How would rescue teams be able to find them? You would not be able to identify a landmark to approximate a location.
I have many more ideas that support the idea of a double homicide. I need to develop them more fully before I share them.
Hi Sylvia,
Yes, both phones were used. However, it’s difficult to know if one person used both phones or two+ people used the phones. It’s interesting, the only evidence we have from that day is the photos from the camera and the phone activity. The photos/SD card were definitely tampered with. But the phone logs would be legitimate – you can’t reprogram phone log activity, especially in the iOS. The only question is…who was using the phones and at which time was each person using them?
In fact, we don’t even know where the phones were used. As far as we know, they could have been in a completely different town/area at that time. The only exception is if GPS coordinates were captured in the phone logs, but I haven’t heard anyone mention that (nor do I know if that’s a default function in the iPhone 4 and the Samsung Galaxy S3). Those GPS coordinates could be critical knowledge if available.
Most people assume that they got “lost in the jungle” but there’s very little real evidence to suggest that. Secondly, hiking through the rainforest is virtually impossible, especially without a machete and durable clothing. Walking off the trail into the jungle is equivalent to walking into 3 to 6 foot wall of sharp plants, vegetation, uneven ground and boulders. I doubt they would even consider it.
Honestly, I don’t look much into the photos and phones because there are too many unknown variables. The camera/phones very well could have been manipulated to a large degree by a third party.
Cheers
Great article. On GPS co-ordinates, yes it is possible to trace call location but you generally need to be quick ( in the UK you also need to obey RIPA). What confuses me is this: when the phones left GPS at about 13.40 on the 1st, was that permanent (meaning, for example, that they couldn’t have returned back down the trail) or would it be more precise to say that no later call was made within a GPS area?
A few observations:
I know I read somewhere that Lisanne was a novice mountaineer. As such, she would have had a minimum of wilderness survival skills. At least that’s what I think. Let’s consider a few scenarios:
Broken Bone–there was adequate wood available to make a rudimentary splint–it could have been held in place by a boot lace
Lack of Safe Water–a bra could be used as a filtering device or water could have been lapped up from leaves
Bleeding Injury–a tourniquet could be fashioned from strips of denim torn from the bottom of shorts or strips of fabric torn from a shirt; moss/leaves could be used as a compress to suppress bleeding
Immobility–a simple travois could be made using wood and vines
Being Lost–doesn’t everyone know that the sun rises in the east? Furthermore if they went beyond the summit, they knew they had crossed the continental divide. The direction the river was flowing would have told them what direction they were going.
Hunger–foliage and insects could be eaten
I have noted a few other things not related to survival skills but I will perhaps share those thoughts later.
Hi Sylvia,
Yes I agree with you. There was ample resources available to survive, albeit uncomfortably unless they found wild mango trees or another native fruit. Additionally, the paths that they walked on had numerous locals walking on them throughout the day.
There’s really no reason for two people to die in this context. Even if they weren’t aware which direction was north vs south, while crossing the continental divide they would have been aware that they were traveling down the face of a large mountain (heading north). Plus, they could have got their bearing by climbing to higher elevation, then they quickly would realize that Boquete (the town) wasn’t beneath them (they would only see farm land, rivers and forest) and one or both could walk to the other side in a 2 to 3 hours.
A lot of people assume that they were in “the jungle”. The truth is that nobody voluntarily walks into the jungle – it’s nearly impossible to walk – essentially a wall of vegetation about 3′ to 6′ high. Even with a machete, it’s a pain in the ass to walk in the jungle. I’ve done it before and it’s not fun. So I highly doubt they would have even considered it. They would have stayed on the paths, unless they were fleeing from danger.
Cheers
Thank you Chris, exactly these notes are important. No coins, I agree with you: there would be coins.
This confirms Juan’s theory of the two backpacks, or that the backpack was packed after (!) The disappearance. The assumption that the money is “hidden” there as a reserve is covered by the fact that Lisanne’s ID and Kris’ social security ID were in the backpack.
– one thing was NOT in the backpack that should have been there: the key to the room.
— Feliciano’s efforts to come into the room confirm my theory that we are not dealing with a third party, but also a fourth party. Two different crimes?
—– By the way, I also suspect that the two girls were separated. The telephone pattern suggests a single person who had to be extremely careful. Mobile phone at night = visible, even in the jungle (if they were there at all)
The last pictures from 01.04. remind me of a hunt.
“Run Kris, or we’ll get you”
Great points. The one that stands out the most to me, is the fact that no room key was in the backpack. That’s a very interesting point. I never realized that.
As everyone knows (especially travelers) – your money, phone and room keys are the most critical belongings that you keep with you. Backpackers/travelers are protective of the key, because the key protects all of your personal belongings from theft while you are not in your room. Not once during my travels do I recall myself, or a fellow traveler, misplacing the room key. In fact, I used a lanyard/cord to clip it around my neck – that’s how important room keys are.
Feliciano never should have been granted access to the room without the direct supervision of law enforcement. In any developed country, behavior like that would immediately be considered to be incriminating. I’m curious about what the owners of the hostel were thinking when they granted Feliciano access to the room. That was a critical error on their part – and they are not stupid, so why did they give them access?
You said “Feliciano’s efforts to come into the room confirm my theory that we are not dealing with a third party, but also a fourth party.”
Can you explain more detail about what you mean? How does Feliciano’s presence imply that there was a fourth party? This sparked my curiosity.
Feliciano is not a person that I think is innocent. But not as the “main” perpetrator.
I think of the following:
Once the deed as such, the two girls disappear. The 3rd party.
Finding the backpack, which was clearly staged 10 weeks later. The fourth party which may not be directly related to the third party.
For Example:
Group or person “A”: Makes the girls disappear and/or has one girl under control, but has no access to the backpack.
Group or person “B”: Has the backpack and uses it for their own purposes or to keep group “A” in check.
After 10 weeks the reappearance of the evidence only happens for one reason:
Someone wanted the search to end. The $30,000 reward was worthless, that’s the reason for trying to end the search.
—-
Feliciano may have very questionable motives, but not necessarily criminal ones. The families e.g. consider him a friend.
Besides, he would hardly be able to stage such theater. He has a good life on his farm. Why should he direct all traces in his direction?
But maybe he also protected his son. This is MY main suspect alongside the dead men of the Caldera swimming club.
Hi Daria,
I’ve sent you an email with some questions.
Cheers
Just a quick note about the $83.00. When I was younger and traveled in Mexico, we NEVER left our money in the room / hotel when we left. Of course, we were older, but we had water-proof containers when we were at the beach, in the water. If they were staying with a host family to do volunteer work, I can almost promise you that they were not paying rent or daily fee. Generally, “host family” implies that the family is offering their home and acommodations for free to the volunteers.
Someone pointed out on quora that Felaciano Tours had a security alert review on trip advisor. A woman posted a review and said joked about “cutting her legs with a machete”. She added he add an obsession for northern women that made her feel uncomfortable.
Sounds like a funny guy…
Of course it’s just speculation but I wonder why he was so implicated after the girl died.
Lint to quota discussion wiicj also contains the link to Felaciano review on TripAdvisor: https://www.quora.com/What-likely-happened-to-Kris-Kremers-and-Lisanne-Froon-after-getting-lost-in-the-Panamanian-jungle/answer/Darryl-Wellman?ch=10&share=1140a4a0&srid=u3d9oG
Guide F entered their room using a ‘hidden’ key that Myriam directed him too. With regard to no room key being found in the back pack maybe they left their key in the same or similar place. Something I’ve done in the past to save me carrying it around with me all day and lessens the risk of losing it. Obviously there are security issues.
yes, the $ 83 is a key.
The taxi ride was $ 5, which is relatively safe.
The bracelets are not bracelets, Lisanne wears her hair ties on her wrist. So these were not bought.
If you just assume that the two girls had $ 100 with them, I think they were already on their way back.
$ 100 – $ 5. means (theoretically) that $ 12 was spent.
Sounds like entrance fee + supermarket purchases.
How much $ the stuff is here: https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOaDcK-zyudR_UXP4xNvvSpKhbEUNHFkl1cvaGaZrvkiKqkgSL0BK5mjUL2SGcDjw/photo/AF1QipP2eyuG0Dh1cs5hXqsqwjzRKN6u5vXstQaEJhTq?key=UjkzUHpsRmtLNUc2RlphdjVTWHRZSVEySjNYS0NR
Value?
The video shows a find by a member of the search party.
Hi Daria,
Good points. I believe that the items in the bag would have cost less than $12 – snacks are very inexpensive in Central America. A typical individual bag of chips costs about $0.15 to $0.25 and a larger bag of chips costs about $1.00. So think that bag of stuff would probably cost about $5 to $6.
As you mention, we’re also assuming that they brought exactly $100 on their day trip. The interesting thing to me is that no coins were found in their backpack. Surely coins would be present if they had bought numerous items. It’s very unusual. Everyone in Central America relies on coins/change on a daily basis.
Thank you for your comments Queen Daria the great 😉
Great name haha
Hey man, interesting view points but the 83$ thing is odd. But also is there pictures of the cash? Was It all in Bills? I assume that it was?
I really wish you would at the very least footnote the bracelet nonsense, if not delete it completely. It is clear the “bracelet” is her hair tie, as her hair is in a ponytail in the picture without the bracelet and her hair is free-flowing when the tie is on her wrist.
Good article. However there are so many unanswered questions. For example whats happened to Kris and Lisanne`s densest and strongest bones. The femur or thigh bones. Oddly where are their clothes. Kris`s red and white stripped top. Ive watched hundreds of documentaries about human remains and some remains are found up to 5 years in roughly the same location plus clothes and never as mysterious as this case.. I wish there was a further expedition to find these items and let these girls rest in peace.
There is so much mystery around this case and in the dutch video there are lots of people in the Panista. I do suspect some sort of foul play.
You are right… I was also wondering – as a girl – why they would have taken off their bras? I mean…I do not know a single girl who would take off a bra on a walk…maybe for swimming in a lake or something but even then I bet most of the girls would just swim in their underwear instead of swimming naked.
I also don‘t think someone would take of a bra for confort reasons out in the wilderness – at home yes…but not running around or what ever.
I feel like no one really discussed that bra-thing. Bras and sunglasses…how would someone imagine that to happen? It‘s not something girls do: taking of their bra as taking of the sunglasses when the sun has gone? That really makes no sense.
It’s POSSIBLE that the girls took their bra’s off because they were HOT!
I completely agree, plus the weird thing is, why both of them took it off!? It’s a weird coincidence, yes maybe one was uncomfortable wearing the bra as the weather was hot and so on…but both? And why put both bras in the same bag!?
If they had planned to go to swim, why no towels in the backpack?
great analysis. i have struggled with diff theories i know about the outdoors and how animals can spread remains etc i was sold on accident theory until i watched the dutch documentary of the parents searching. shortly after daylight in the jungle commencing their search..as the locals are prepping the parents on the hike and surroundings… you can clearly hear one of the local guides say to another in spanish…. “dont tell them anything about” but its one of the scenes where the camera shuts off for a moment then comes back on… so u dont hear the rest as for the parents they are speaking in dutch… maybe theres simple explanation for comment.. but i believe sumone is hiding something… most ppl focus on an incident as a “destination” trying to link the pieces heading towards the known outcome… but everything that happened prior to them arriving at the venue…is equally important… specifically anyone who knew of their plans…. more ppl should watch that video…esp spanish speakers
Hi gm, I agree with you and I remember exactly the video that you mentioned. Here is the part where he says “Don’t say anything about…(end)”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOyg5Qloz7o&feature=youtu.be&t=318
Thank you for your message. Cheers
I just wanted to mention something due to the thing with Lisanne‘s bracelets: on these two pictures showed in your blogpost, Lisanne is wearing her hair up in one of those pictures- and of course she isn‘t wearing a „bracelet“ in this picture…if it was a hair tie. That would also explain why she is wearing a „bracelet“ in that picture with her hair down – cause that is what girls do – they put their hair ties on the wrist…
And you are also not able to see her other hand in this picture – so you wouldn‘t be able to tell if she is wearing the other bracelets.
I also believe that the hair ties would have come off their wrists and put into their hair to pull it off their neck as they got hotter and hotter….They were from Holland which would make this heat and humidity seem even more uncomfortable to them than people from the Western Hemisphere. If you have long hair, the first thing you want to do in a hot and humid environment is to get your long hair off your neck…to cool you down!